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Does Opera really count as a Phantom movie? It shares a few basic elements, yes, but the story overall is vastly different and Dario Argento has never mentioned being influenced by the book at all. SergeantLuke (talk) 18:34, 31 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2012-12-31T18:34:00.000Z","author":"SergeantLuke","type":"comment","level":1,"id":"c-SergeantLuke-2012-12-31T18:34:00.000Z","replies":["c-Oknazevad-2013-08-17T19:00:00.000Z-SergeantLuke-2012-12-31T18:34:00.000Z"]}}-->
Agreed. He did his Phantom movie, and its not (Terror at the) Opera. It isn't really an adaptation of the story, so doesn't really belong. I'll remove it. oknazevad (talk) 19:00, 17 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-17T19:00:00.000Z","author":"Oknazevad","type":"comment","level":2,"id":"c-Oknazevad-2013-08-17T19:00:00.000Z-SergeantLuke-2012-12-31T18:34:00.000Z","replies":["c-Friginator-2013-08-17T21:47:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-17T19:00:00.000Z"]}}-->
The template is intended to list works related to the novel, not just direct adaptations. If the section was only intended to list adaptations of the original novel, it wouldn't include the adaptations of the Andrew Lloyd Webber musical, No, the film doesn't follow the book any more than Phantom of the Paradise or Phantom of the Mall: Eric's Revenge, but it's still related. Films like Phantom of the Megaplex, however, should be avoided as beyond the title, they have no connection to the source material. Friginator (talk) 21:47, 17 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-17T21:47:00.000Z","author":"Friginator","type":"comment","level":3,"id":"c-Friginator-2013-08-17T21:47:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-17T19:00:00.000Z","replies":["c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T03:57:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-17T21:47:00.000Z"]}}-->
But that's just it, there's real doubt, by multiple editors, that it is related. Other than being set at an opera house, the film has nothing to do with the novel. Just being a murder mystery set at an opera house does not make it a related work. Especially since, as noted by SergeantLuke, there seems to be no record of the director of the film calling the novel a basis for the film. Without such, including it here seems too close to original research for comfort. oknazevad (talk) 03:57, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-18T03:57:00.000Z","author":"Oknazevad","type":"comment","level":4,"id":"c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T03:57:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-17T21:47:00.000Z","replies":["c-Friginator-2013-08-18T04:55:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T03:57:00.000Z"]}}-->
There's doubt that a film about a masked man obsessed with an aspiring soprano killing people in an opera house is in some way related to the Phantom of the Opera? Is it an adaptation of the novel? Obviously not. I don't think anyone's arguing that. But is it related to the subject? I'd say that seems like common sense. Friginator (talk) 04:55, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-18T04:55:00.000Z","author":"Friginator","type":"comment","level":5,"id":"c-Friginator-2013-08-18T04:55:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T03:57:00.000Z","replies":["c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T13:56:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-18T04:55:00.000Z"]}}-->
Unless someone connected to the production says such, or a prominent reviewer makes such an observation, then yes, it is original research to make the claim on our own, no matter what. It becomes WP:SYNTH to draw conclusions not made elsewhere. That is simply not allowed on Wikipedia. I would also note that outside of this navbox, our article on Opera doesn't even mention Phantom at all. oknazevad (talk) 13:56, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-18T13:56:00.000Z","author":"Oknazevad","type":"comment","level":6,"id":"c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T13:56:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-18T04:55:00.000Z","replies":["c-Friginator-2013-08-18T18:15:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T13:56:00.000Z"]}}-->
Having looked up the subject, the allmovie review mentions the connection. Multiple reviews listed on Rotten Tomatoes (herehere and here) mention the connection. On top of that, multiple books on Dario Argento make the connection as well (herehere and here). That should be sufficient in terms of sources. Friginator (talk) 18:15, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-18T18:15:00.000Z","author":"Friginator","type":"comment","level":7,"id":"c-Friginator-2013-08-18T18:15:00.000Z-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T13:56:00.000Z","replies":["c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T18:57:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-18T18:15:00.000Z"]}}-->
Works for me! oknazevad (talk) 18:57, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]__DTELLIPSISBUTTON__{"threadItem":{"timestamp":"2013-08-18T18:57:00.000Z","author":"Oknazevad","type":"comment","level":9,"id":"c-Oknazevad-2013-08-18T18:57:00.000Z-Friginator-2013-08-18T18:15:00.000Z","replies":[]}}-->
